Game steup ideas

[naf1138]

So the basic outline of the game setup is:

We have 19 players, 5 are scum, one is a limited one shot cop and we start with a Night start.

The cop must use his one shot ability on Night 1. The scum must select a member of their ranks to do the killing. One player will start the game dead. (sucks to be them)

At the start of the game each player is given 6 identifying pieces of information about themselves, one publicly known to the town, 5 only known to the players themselves. When a player is killed they are given a piece of information about their killer, and are given the opportunity to write their own death scene.

What we need, enough individual atrubutes that we can greate 19 characters with six pieces of info each.

A decision as to whether or not to have the info overlap.

IF the info does overlap, can scum and town share the same attributes? (ie two soccer fans, one scum one town?)

A decision on EXACTLY how the cop character will work. Do they know all the attributes of the player they select but not the alignment? Do they know the alignment but not the attributes? Do they know the allignment ant attibutes but not the player name? I don't think it is a good idea to give the cop all three pieces of info.

A decision on a time limit on when the players can submit their death scenes. Must they have it in by the time the Day starts?
Can they wait until the following Day? Can they submit their info at any time at all in the game?

A decision on how long the Day's will last (I think at least 7 real days for Day 1) and how lynches will be handled. I liked what majority lynch did to the game in firefly, but maybe it needs to be tweaked a little.

A decision on how secret the cop role should be. Do we want to keep the role secret at all? I think yes. Do we want to keep the existance of a secret role a secret also? I am not sure. I think we should let the town know that there will be no additional killing roles, or recruitment from the outset.

What does everyone else think?

[roosh2]

Here's my issue with this:
It basically feels like the Town is screwed.

There are 5 scum, 14 nonscum, right?
And 19 public pieces of information- but we don't know who gets the information? Or do we?
1. Like the public information, do we know who gets each of THOSE attributes?

2. My issue: If each person has 6 unique things about themselves, HOW do the townspeople know what do with writing up a death scene? What exactly is the use in knowing "Well, your killer wears a size 9 shoe" if you don't know WHO your killer is (because if they know who the killer is too, why can't they just say "A guy with the name tag who you remember making a post recently on how he's a jail house Doctor is the one who killed me. Oh yeah, and he's got a size 9 shoe"
--See, that's a case where you don't want to identify WHO the killer is. So the victims should NOT know who killed them specifically.
--But if all they're given is the size 9 shoe... What good is that information, UNLESS each of the 6 unique traits are ALL related but NOT to another person's unique 6 traits (ie: The Shoe person has 6 different traits all of them deal with feet or shoes in some way).
--Because the town needs a way to correlate ONE random fact to ANOTHER random fact. How is this going to work?

3. If i were scum, what's to prevent me from just simply rotating the kills, so that everyone kills on a different night. That's 5 different Kills, 5 different random information tidbits.
What can do the town do with that?
-In my view, the town is fucked, and reduced to random voting... as they won't know how to correlate death scenes and information to the information they have.
-->And in the case of when it gets reduced to RANDOM voting, SCUM Will always have the advantage because that's 5 votes that can be placed NON-Randomly, so anyone who is scum can be "saved" from being lynched simply by having 1-2 people manipulate the votes. And then the next night simply bump off those that ask too many questions.


I basically see this setup as VERY VERY VERY Pro-Scum.
As it's basically 5 Scum vs. 14 headless townies, and NO help being given to the townies (because if scum kill the OneShot PowerRole Night one, the town is fucked) [Always, always think of the worst case scenario for Day 1].
All they're given is random information, that I don't think will really help them out.
Can you clarify to me a bit more how the Townies even have a CHANCE of winning here? I'm just not seeing how the death scenes will help out the town as correlating with the "public information"

[naf1138]

roosh2 said:

Here's my issue with this:
It basically feels like the Town is screwed.

There are 5 scum, 14 nonscum, right?
And 19 public pieces of information- but we don't know who gets the information? Or do we?
1. Like the public information, do we know who gets each of THOSE attributes?

2. My issue: If each person has 6 unique things about themselves, HOW do the townspeople know what do with writing up a death scene? What exactly is the use in knowing "Well, your killer wears a size 9 shoe" if you don't know WHO your killer is (because if they know who the killer is too, why can't they just say "A guy with the name tag who you remember making a post recently on how he's a jail house Doctor is the one who killed me. Oh yeah, and he's got a size 9 shoe"
--See, that's a case where you don't want to identify WHO the killer is. So the victims should NOT know who killed them specifically.
--But if all they're given is the size 9 shoe... What good is that information, UNLESS each of the 6 unique traits are ALL related but NOT to another person's unique 6 traits (ie: The Shoe person has 6 different traits all of them deal with feet or shoes in some way).
--Because the town needs a way to correlate ONE random fact to ANOTHER random fact. How is this going to work?

3. If i were scum, what's to prevent me from just simply rotating the kills, so that everyone kills on a different night. That's 5 different Kills, 5 different random information tidbits.
What can do the town do with that?
-In my view, the town is fucked, and reduced to random voting... as they won't know how to correlate death scenes and information to the information they have.
-->And in the case of when it gets reduced to RANDOM voting, SCUM Will always have the advantage because that's 5 votes that can be placed NON-Randomly, so anyone who is scum can be "saved" from being lynched simply by having 1-2 people manipulate the votes. And then the next night simply bump off those that ask too many questions.


I basically see this setup as VERY VERY VERY Pro-Scum.
As it's basically 5 Scum vs. 14 headless townies, and NO help being given to the townies (because if scum kill the OneShot PowerRole Night one, the town is fucked) [Always, always think of the worst case scenario for Day 1].
All they're given is random information, that I don't think will really help them out.
Can you clarify to me a bit more how the Townies even have a CHANCE of winning here? I'm just not seeing how the death scenes will help out the town as correlating with the "public information"

Well three things. 1 is the secret role. It's a one shot cop who uses their power night 1. If the town loses that role right away too bad for the town. Town has won games after losing the cop right away before.

2) is yes, the public information will be directly related to one of the people. So 17% of the time the information will directly implicate scum. More or less give the town 100% confirmed scum.

The rest, well its just mafia after that. If the town gets the scum talking, the scum will get caught. This is how I always played mafia IRL and town won more often then not (not much more, but more). My concern was that the dossier system gave the town too much information. But town doesn't need cops or doctors to win. Do you think taking out one of the scum will help? What about making it 5 atributes instead of 6?

What do you think Steven? Upon reflection is it too stacked against the town?

[mtgman]

I think we should move this discussion to the rules thread, then we can work from the actual construct of the Dossier system. Then we can talk specifics. roosh, nice to have you buddy. If you want to check out the rules post thread and read NAF's posts there I think the way the system works will be a little clearer.

Enjoy,
Steven